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	<title>Comments on: How Nintendo Wii Graphics Overcome the Lack of Horsepower</title>
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		<title>By: Francis Follett</title>
		<link>http://royaltutorial.com/how-nintendo-wii-graphics-overcome-the-lack-of-horsepower/comment-page-1/#comment-1964</link>
		<dc:creator>Francis Follett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 May 2010 14:59:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Video production at its best! Do you have any advice for someone just out of school</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Video production at its best! Do you have any advice for someone just out of school</p>
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		<title>By: Francisco Javier Ogushi Dominguez</title>
		<link>http://royaltutorial.com/how-nintendo-wii-graphics-overcome-the-lack-of-horsepower/comment-page-1/#comment-1451</link>
		<dc:creator>Francisco Javier Ogushi Dominguez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jan 2010 00:53:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://royaltutorial.com/?p=176#comment-1451</guid>
		<description>Your are not being fair since you are avoiding games like Resident Evil DarkSide Chronicles, Monster Hunter 3, Cursed Mountain, Dead Space Extraction and  Silent Hill, all those games support HDR+AA, and every pc gamer knows that to achieve HDR+AA is necessary the power of at least an ATI R520.

Wii may not have a powerfuk cpu, but that can be solved with the use of gpgpu, like the Floodgate form Gamebryo LighSpeed compatible for Wii. 

If you want to know the specs of the ATI Hollywood I can give a very good approximation based in irrefutable facts. 

I consider ATI Hollywood between an ATI Rv610 and an ATI Rv630 

Why? 

Fiest of all, there are many wii games like Monster Hunter 3, Resident Evil, Silent Hill, Cursed Mountain, etc, that have shown both HDR and antialaising in real time graphics, and that wasnt possible until the ATI R520 came out thanks to thier new architecture and tecnology. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon 

&quot; 

ATI&#039;s DirectX 9.0c series of graphics cards, with complete Shader Model 3.0 support. Launched in October 2005, this series brought a number of enhancements including the floating point render target technology necessary for HDR rendering with anti-aliasing. Cards released include X1300 - X1950. 
&quot; 


Ok, with that we know that ATI Hollywood must be at least an R520 for doing HDR+AA, but why I consider Hollywood like an ATI Rv610, simple.- 


1.- According to one of the displacment mapping patents of Nintendo(expires in 2020), the Hollywood might have a command processor and is capable of vertex texture fetch, and those features were avaiable begining from ATI R600; plus, Satoru Iwata said that Wii´s hadware woud take at least 8 more years to be squeezed, and that when the time came when the hadware started to slowdown, that would be when they would release wii2 

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6980218/fulltext.html 

&quot; 

US Patent Issued on December 27, 2005 
Estimated Patent Expiration Date: November 28, 2020Estimated Expiration Date is calculated based on simple USPTO term provisions. It does not account for terminal disclaimers, term adjustments, failure to pay maintenance fees, or other factors which might affect the term of a patent. 

Command processor 200 receives display commands from main processor 110 and parses them—obtaining any additional data necessary to process them from shared memory 112. The command processor 200 provides a stream of vertex commands to graphics pipeline 180 for 2D and/or 3D processing and rendering. Graphics pipeline 180 generates images based on these commands. The resulting image information may be transferred to main memory 112 for access by display controller/video interface unit 164—which displays the frame buffer output of pipeline 180 on display 56. 

FIG. 5 is a logical flow diagram of graphics processor 154. Main processor 110 may store graphics command streams 210, display lists 212 and vertex arrays 214 in main memory 112, and pass pointers to command processor 200 via bus interface 150. The main processor 110 stores graphics commands in one or more graphics first-in-first-out (FIFO) buffers 210 it allocates in main memory 110. The command processor 200 fetches: command streams from main memory 112 via an on-chip FIFO memory buffer 216 that receives and buffers the graphics commands for synchronization/flow control and load balancing, display lists 212 from main memory 112 via an on-chip call FIFO memory buffer 218, and vertex attributes from the command stream and/or from vertex arrays 214 in main memory 112 via a vertex cache 220. 

Command processor 200 performs command processing operations 200a that convert attribute types to floating point format, and pass the resulting complete vertex polygon data to graphics pipeline 180 for rendering/rasterization. A programmable memory arbitration circuitry 130 (see FIG. 4) arbitrates access to shared main memory 112 between graphics pipeline 180, command processor 200 and display controller/video interface unit 164. 

&quot; 


Neither vertex texture fetch nor command processor were avaible in inferior series to the ATI R600. 

Vertex texture fetch avaible in ati R600 but not in neither R520 nor R580 
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/r600-architecture_5.html 
&quot; 
The Radeon HD 2000 texture processor is a highly integrated device configured like follows: 

8 texture address units to calculate the address to sample 
20 texture samplers 
4 texture filter units 

The new texture processor supports filtering of FP32 textures as well as the vertex texture fetch feature the Radeon X1000 did not support. It also supports 8192x8192 textures and RGBE 9:9:9:5 texture format to comply with DirectX 10 requirements. Besides everything else, ATI/AMD claims an improved quality of anisotropic filtering. 

&quot; 



2.- ATI Rv610 power consumption is very low, between 25 to 35 watts ad if we check the Wii´s power power supply, it clearly says that wii consumes 53 watts max. 

http://komku.blogspot.com/2007/03/amd-ati-rv610-and-rv630-specs-amd-rv610.html 

&quot; 
RV610 and RV630 support PCIe 2.0 for increased bandwidth. Native support for CrossFire remains, as with current ATI Radeon X1650 XT and X1950 Pro products. AMD will also debut RV610 and RV630 on a 65nm manufacturing processor for low-power consumption. Expect RV610 products to consume around 25 to 35-watts. RV630 requires more power at around 75 to 128-watts. 
&quot; 

Not to mention that if the Broadway is really a g3 750cl, then it´s power consumption is that low that if it run at 600Mhz it would only consume 2.7 watts, Broadway runs at 729 Mgz, so I don´t think it can consume more than 5 watts even if it´s an upgraded 750cl. 

As for the dvd drive, I can´t see it cosuming more than 10 watts 


3.- ATI Rv610 was really inexpensive, was launched in the ATI Radeon HD 2400 pro with a price of just 59 dollars, and as we know, ATI Hollywood´s production cost was about $30 dollars. 

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&amp;item=762&amp;num=1 
&quot; 

Making up the Radeon HD 2400 series right now is the HD 2400PRO and the HD 2400XT, which both use the RV610 GPU and feature 40 shader units, 180 million transistors, and 256MB 64-bit memory. The Radeon HD 2400PRO has a stock operating frequency of 525MHz for its core and 400MHz for its video memory while the Radeon HD 2400XT has its core running at 700MHz with the memory doubled at 800MHz. The prices for the low-end 2400PRO and 2400XT are $59 and $79 USD respectively. These ATI/AMD cards are of course competition for the NVIDIA GeForce 8500GT. 

&quot; 

ATI Hollywood cost production of 29.60 dollars 
http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2006/12/18/nintendo_wii_profit_on_production/ 
&quot; 
Nintendo said to profit on Wii production 
Consoles costs under $160 to manufacture? 

By Tony Smith • Get more from this author 

18th December 2006 10:50 GMT 

Nintendo may well be making so much profit on its Wii console it can well afford to replace broken Remote straps. According to a Japanese publication&#039;s assessment of the machine&#039;s innards, the console costs the videogames company less than $160 to assemble. 

In a report published by Japanese business weekly the Toyo Keizai and relayed by Japanese-language site WiiInside, the most expensive component inside the Wii is the DVD drive, which, the paper estimates, costs $31. Next comes ATI&#039;s &#039;Hollywood&#039; graphics chip, at $29.60. The IBM-designed and made CPU, &#039;Broadway&#039;, costs $13, the report reckons. 

&quot; 

4.- Die size, as we know, the ATI Hollywoods has two dies, vegas and napa 

vegas is supposed to be the dsp with 24 MBytes of NEC´s embedded memory and measure 72mm2 

napa is the true GPU it´s die size is of 94.5mm2, but since it has embedded an ARM926EJ-S that measures like 1.45mm2 in 90nm and also other components for the SD and usb, the true gpu part most likely be about 90mm2; plus, ati imageons are about 3 to 8 mm2 depending of their complexity. 

Lets also consider that napa might have just 3MBytes of embedded memory, wich is made of NEC´s UX6D(1T-SRAM-Q made of MIM2 technology), but there are rumors like those that came from an interview with ubisoft pointing that napa might have 8 MBytes 

1mm2 = 0.5618 Mbytes 
5.34mm2 = 3.0000 Mbytes 

8MBytes = 14.24mm2 

90mm2 - 5.34mm2 = 84.66mm2 

90mm2 - 14.24mm2 = 75.76mm2 

If we consider the fact that ATI Rv610 is 85mm2 and that ATI Hollywood´s gpu is about 84.66mm2 or 75.76mm2, then Hollywood´s gpu is very near an ATI Rv610; but wait, it doesnt end there since aTI Rv610 has a clock speed of 450Mhz, and ATI Hollywood is 243mhz, and we must remember that since more mhz means more transistors, then more die size is used, so if ATI Rv610 had a clock speed of 243Mhz, the die size should be very lower. 

Here is an interview with NEC that confirms that the embedded memory in Hollywood is UX6D 

http://gear.ign.com/articles/713/713254p1.html 


So yea, ATI Hollywood´s GPU is about an ATI Rv610 and an ATI Rv630, and for those who consider Hollywood slightluy more powerful than xbox gou, then tell me of an xbox game that did HDR(eye, true HDR not faked like Zelda Twilight princess) 



On purpose, even though the ATI Rv610 was released in the last months of 2007, it was expected to be launched in Feb of 2007, but ATI decided to delay the launch due to market strategy and to add more Windows Vista drivers. The ATI Hollywood wasn´t finished neither at the E32006 not at June 2006 and there is an article at IGN that has an interview with NEC(June 2006) that says that they would supply Embedded memory to Wii based on the last designs of Mosys 1TS-RAM technology(1T-SRAM-MIM was their current generation) and the macro that they would provide is suggested to be UX6D(1T-SRAM technology combined with MIM2).What I try to say is that the dates of ATI Hollywood launch and the ATI Rv610 are very close.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your are not being fair since you are avoiding games like Resident Evil DarkSide Chronicles, Monster Hunter 3, Cursed Mountain, Dead Space Extraction and  Silent Hill, all those games support HDR+AA, and every pc gamer knows that to achieve HDR+AA is necessary the power of at least an ATI R520.</p>
<p>Wii may not have a powerfuk cpu, but that can be solved with the use of gpgpu, like the Floodgate form Gamebryo LighSpeed compatible for Wii. </p>
<p>If you want to know the specs of the ATI Hollywood I can give a very good approximation based in irrefutable facts. </p>
<p>I consider ATI Hollywood between an ATI Rv610 and an ATI Rv630 </p>
<p>Why? </p>
<p>Fiest of all, there are many wii games like Monster Hunter 3, Resident Evil, Silent Hill, Cursed Mountain, etc, that have shown both HDR and antialaising in real time graphics, and that wasnt possible until the ATI R520 came out thanks to thier new architecture and tecnology. </p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon</a> </p>
<p>&#8221; </p>
<p>ATI&#8217;s DirectX 9.0c series of graphics cards, with complete Shader Model 3.0 support. Launched in October 2005, this series brought a number of enhancements including the floating point render target technology necessary for HDR rendering with anti-aliasing. Cards released include X1300 &#8211; X1950.<br />
&#8221; </p>
<p>Ok, with that we know that ATI Hollywood must be at least an R520 for doing HDR+AA, but why I consider Hollywood like an ATI Rv610, simple.- </p>
<p>1.- According to one of the displacment mapping patents of Nintendo(expires in 2020), the Hollywood might have a command processor and is capable of vertex texture fetch, and those features were avaiable begining from ATI R600; plus, Satoru Iwata said that Wii´s hadware woud take at least 8 more years to be squeezed, and that when the time came when the hadware started to slowdown, that would be when they would release wii2 </p>
<p><a href="http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6980218/fulltext.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6980218/fulltext.html</a> </p>
<p>&#8221; </p>
<p>US Patent Issued on December 27, 2005<br />
Estimated Patent Expiration Date: November 28, 2020Estimated Expiration Date is calculated based on simple USPTO term provisions. It does not account for terminal disclaimers, term adjustments, failure to pay maintenance fees, or other factors which might affect the term of a patent. </p>
<p>Command processor 200 receives display commands from main processor 110 and parses them—obtaining any additional data necessary to process them from shared memory 112. The command processor 200 provides a stream of vertex commands to graphics pipeline 180 for 2D and/or 3D processing and rendering. Graphics pipeline 180 generates images based on these commands. The resulting image information may be transferred to main memory 112 for access by display controller/video interface unit 164—which displays the frame buffer output of pipeline 180 on display 56. </p>
<p>FIG. 5 is a logical flow diagram of graphics processor 154. Main processor 110 may store graphics command streams 210, display lists 212 and vertex arrays 214 in main memory 112, and pass pointers to command processor 200 via bus interface 150. The main processor 110 stores graphics commands in one or more graphics first-in-first-out (FIFO) buffers 210 it allocates in main memory 110. The command processor 200 fetches: command streams from main memory 112 via an on-chip FIFO memory buffer 216 that receives and buffers the graphics commands for synchronization/flow control and load balancing, display lists 212 from main memory 112 via an on-chip call FIFO memory buffer 218, and vertex attributes from the command stream and/or from vertex arrays 214 in main memory 112 via a vertex cache 220. </p>
<p>Command processor 200 performs command processing operations 200a that convert attribute types to floating point format, and pass the resulting complete vertex polygon data to graphics pipeline 180 for rendering/rasterization. A programmable memory arbitration circuitry 130 (see FIG. 4) arbitrates access to shared main memory 112 between graphics pipeline 180, command processor 200 and display controller/video interface unit 164. </p>
<p>&#8221; </p>
<p>Neither vertex texture fetch nor command processor were avaible in inferior series to the ATI R600. </p>
<p>Vertex texture fetch avaible in ati R600 but not in neither R520 nor R580<br />
<a href="http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/r600-architecture_5.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/r600-architecture_5.html</a><br />
&#8221;<br />
The Radeon HD 2000 texture processor is a highly integrated device configured like follows: </p>
<p>8 texture address units to calculate the address to sample<br />
20 texture samplers<br />
4 texture filter units </p>
<p>The new texture processor supports filtering of FP32 textures as well as the vertex texture fetch feature the Radeon X1000 did not support. It also supports 8192&#215;8192 textures and RGBE 9:9:9:5 texture format to comply with DirectX 10 requirements. Besides everything else, ATI/AMD claims an improved quality of anisotropic filtering. </p>
<p>&#8221; </p>
<p>2.- ATI Rv610 power consumption is very low, between 25 to 35 watts ad if we check the Wii´s power power supply, it clearly says that wii consumes 53 watts max. </p>
<p><a href="http://komku.blogspot.com/2007/03/amd-ati-rv610-and-rv630-specs-amd-rv610.html" rel="nofollow">http://komku.blogspot.com/2007/03/amd-ati-rv610-and-rv630-specs-amd-rv610.html</a> </p>
<p>&#8221;<br />
RV610 and RV630 support PCIe 2.0 for increased bandwidth. Native support for CrossFire remains, as with current ATI Radeon X1650 XT and X1950 Pro products. AMD will also debut RV610 and RV630 on a 65nm manufacturing processor for low-power consumption. Expect RV610 products to consume around 25 to 35-watts. RV630 requires more power at around 75 to 128-watts.<br />
&#8221; </p>
<p>Not to mention that if the Broadway is really a g3 750cl, then it´s power consumption is that low that if it run at 600Mhz it would only consume 2.7 watts, Broadway runs at 729 Mgz, so I don´t think it can consume more than 5 watts even if it´s an upgraded 750cl. </p>
<p>As for the dvd drive, I can´t see it cosuming more than 10 watts </p>
<p>3.- ATI Rv610 was really inexpensive, was launched in the ATI Radeon HD 2400 pro with a price of just 59 dollars, and as we know, ATI Hollywood´s production cost was about $30 dollars. </p>
<p><a href="http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&amp;item=762&amp;num=1" rel="nofollow">http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&amp;item=762&amp;num=1</a><br />
&#8221; </p>
<p>Making up the Radeon HD 2400 series right now is the HD 2400PRO and the HD 2400XT, which both use the RV610 GPU and feature 40 shader units, 180 million transistors, and 256MB 64-bit memory. The Radeon HD 2400PRO has a stock operating frequency of 525MHz for its core and 400MHz for its video memory while the Radeon HD 2400XT has its core running at 700MHz with the memory doubled at 800MHz. The prices for the low-end 2400PRO and 2400XT are $59 and $79 USD respectively. These ATI/AMD cards are of course competition for the NVIDIA GeForce 8500GT. </p>
<p>&#8221; </p>
<p>ATI Hollywood cost production of 29.60 dollars<br />
<a href="http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2006/12/18/nintendo_wii_profit_on_production/" rel="nofollow">http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2006/12/18/nintendo_wii_profit_on_production/</a><br />
&#8221;<br />
Nintendo said to profit on Wii production<br />
Consoles costs under $160 to manufacture? </p>
<p>By Tony Smith • Get more from this author </p>
<p>18th December 2006 10:50 GMT </p>
<p>Nintendo may well be making so much profit on its Wii console it can well afford to replace broken Remote straps. According to a Japanese publication&#8217;s assessment of the machine&#8217;s innards, the console costs the videogames company less than $160 to assemble. </p>
<p>In a report published by Japanese business weekly the Toyo Keizai and relayed by Japanese-language site WiiInside, the most expensive component inside the Wii is the DVD drive, which, the paper estimates, costs $31. Next comes ATI&#8217;s &#8216;Hollywood&#8217; graphics chip, at $29.60. The IBM-designed and made CPU, &#8216;Broadway&#8217;, costs $13, the report reckons. </p>
<p>&#8221; </p>
<p>4.- Die size, as we know, the ATI Hollywoods has two dies, vegas and napa </p>
<p>vegas is supposed to be the dsp with 24 MBytes of NEC´s embedded memory and measure 72mm2 </p>
<p>napa is the true GPU it´s die size is of 94.5mm2, but since it has embedded an ARM926EJ-S that measures like 1.45mm2 in 90nm and also other components for the SD and usb, the true gpu part most likely be about 90mm2; plus, ati imageons are about 3 to 8 mm2 depending of their complexity. </p>
<p>Lets also consider that napa might have just 3MBytes of embedded memory, wich is made of NEC´s UX6D(1T-SRAM-Q made of MIM2 technology), but there are rumors like those that came from an interview with ubisoft pointing that napa might have 8 MBytes </p>
<p>1mm2 = 0.5618 Mbytes<br />
5.34mm2 = 3.0000 Mbytes </p>
<p>8MBytes = 14.24mm2 </p>
<p>90mm2 &#8211; 5.34mm2 = 84.66mm2 </p>
<p>90mm2 &#8211; 14.24mm2 = 75.76mm2 </p>
<p>If we consider the fact that ATI Rv610 is 85mm2 and that ATI Hollywood´s gpu is about 84.66mm2 or 75.76mm2, then Hollywood´s gpu is very near an ATI Rv610; but wait, it doesnt end there since aTI Rv610 has a clock speed of 450Mhz, and ATI Hollywood is 243mhz, and we must remember that since more mhz means more transistors, then more die size is used, so if ATI Rv610 had a clock speed of 243Mhz, the die size should be very lower. </p>
<p>Here is an interview with NEC that confirms that the embedded memory in Hollywood is UX6D </p>
<p><a href="http://gear.ign.com/articles/713/713254p1.html" rel="nofollow">http://gear.ign.com/articles/713/713254p1.html</a> </p>
<p>So yea, ATI Hollywood´s GPU is about an ATI Rv610 and an ATI Rv630, and for those who consider Hollywood slightluy more powerful than xbox gou, then tell me of an xbox game that did HDR(eye, true HDR not faked like Zelda Twilight princess) </p>
<p>On purpose, even though the ATI Rv610 was released in the last months of 2007, it was expected to be launched in Feb of 2007, but ATI decided to delay the launch due to market strategy and to add more Windows Vista drivers. The ATI Hollywood wasn´t finished neither at the E32006 not at June 2006 and there is an article at IGN that has an interview with NEC(June 2006) that says that they would supply Embedded memory to Wii based on the last designs of Mosys 1TS-RAM technology(1T-SRAM-MIM was their current generation) and the macro that they would provide is suggested to be UX6D(1T-SRAM technology combined with MIM2).What I try to say is that the dates of ATI Hollywood launch and the ATI Rv610 are very close.</p>
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		<title>By: bernardo</title>
		<link>http://royaltutorial.com/how-nintendo-wii-graphics-overcome-the-lack-of-horsepower/comment-page-1/#comment-1166</link>
		<dc:creator>bernardo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:41:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Hey this was potentially one of the most effective posts I&#039;ve had the chance to go over on the subject so far. I don&#039;t understand where you learn all your information but I am impressed! I&#039;m going to send a few individuals on over to read this. Amazing, totally awesome. I&#039;m just getting into writing articles myself, nothing compared to your writing potential (lol) but I&#039;d love for you to check out my articles someday! &lt;a href=&quot;http://astore.amazon.com/bowflex.series.7.treadmill.sale-20&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;right here&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey this was potentially one of the most effective posts I&#8217;ve had the chance to go over on the subject so far. I don&#8217;t understand where you learn all your information but I am impressed! I&#8217;m going to send a few individuals on over to read this. Amazing, totally awesome. I&#8217;m just getting into writing articles myself, nothing compared to your writing potential (lol) but I&#8217;d love for you to check out my articles someday! <a href="http://astore.amazon.com/bowflex.series.7.treadmill.sale-20" rel="nofollow">right here</a></p>
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		<title>By: Jess Longe</title>
		<link>http://royaltutorial.com/how-nintendo-wii-graphics-overcome-the-lack-of-horsepower/comment-page-1/#comment-935</link>
		<dc:creator>Jess Longe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 17:25:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://royaltutorial.com/?p=176#comment-935</guid>
		<description>Hi, loved the post but quick question...I had a little difficulty loading your page - I use firefox, do you think this was the problem...Bookmarked :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, loved the post but quick question&#8230;I had a little difficulty loading your page &#8211; I use firefox, do you think this was the problem&#8230;Bookmarked <img src='http://royaltutorial.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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